“With my/their/our V-ing…” as supplement to main clausewith/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phraseDoes a gerund always end with “-ing”? If so, why?Can “once” and “since” be followed by a V-ing clause?When is it acceptable to start a sentence with an “-ing” word?Adding “-ing” to a verb ending with a pronounced “e”why come ing with verb after prepositionHow do you assign Case to sentences with an infinitival clause?Using the Possessive with Gerunds: appreciate their thinking or appreciate them thinking?Having a ing with an object in a sentenceWhat’s the un­der­ly­ing gram­mar be­hind start­ing off a ɢᴇʀᴜɴᴅ clause with an ᴏʙ­ᴊᴇᴄᴛ pro­noun?with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phrase

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“With my/their/our V-ing…” as supplement to main clause


with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phraseDoes a gerund always end with “-ing”? If so, why?Can “once” and “since” be followed by a V-ing clause?When is it acceptable to start a sentence with an “-ing” word?Adding “-ing” to a verb ending with a pronounced “e”why come ing with verb after prepositionHow do you assign Case to sentences with an infinitival clause?Using the Possessive with Gerunds: appreciate their thinking or appreciate them thinking?Having a ing with an object in a sentenceWhat’s the un­der­ly­ing gram­mar be­hind start­ing off a ɢᴇʀᴜɴᴅ clause with an ᴏʙ­ᴊᴇᴄᴛ pro­noun?with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phrase






.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;








0















Here are some news article examples containing 'with my/their etc. being...' as supplement to a main clause:




(1) Since the opposing counsel would be the U.S. Department of Justice, and with my being new to that game, I enlisted as co-counsel an accomplished federal litigator with extensive experience in dealing with the DOJ. (Source)



(2) Since this raised many leftists' ire and with my being the reasonable man I am, I propose a compromise: no immigrants from the Third World or the Old World. In other words, no immigration, period. (Source)



(3) The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and with their being hired by Divine Hope Church, both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name. (Source)




Is the use of genitive pronouns (my, their, etc.) well-formed and natural?



Or is it better to have accusative pronouns (me, them, etc.) instead?



EDIT



In a related question "with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phrase", I have shown this example from The Cambridge Grammar of the English Language (Page 461):




We set off again, the Rover going precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with me staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether.




CGEL says, and I agree, that my cannot replace me in this sentence.



If the above examples (1)-(3) are well-formed and natural, how do you distinguish (1)-(3) from the CGEL example?










share|improve this question






























    0















    Here are some news article examples containing 'with my/their etc. being...' as supplement to a main clause:




    (1) Since the opposing counsel would be the U.S. Department of Justice, and with my being new to that game, I enlisted as co-counsel an accomplished federal litigator with extensive experience in dealing with the DOJ. (Source)



    (2) Since this raised many leftists' ire and with my being the reasonable man I am, I propose a compromise: no immigrants from the Third World or the Old World. In other words, no immigration, period. (Source)



    (3) The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and with their being hired by Divine Hope Church, both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name. (Source)




    Is the use of genitive pronouns (my, their, etc.) well-formed and natural?



    Or is it better to have accusative pronouns (me, them, etc.) instead?



    EDIT



    In a related question "with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phrase", I have shown this example from The Cambridge Grammar of the English Language (Page 461):




    We set off again, the Rover going precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with me staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether.




    CGEL says, and I agree, that my cannot replace me in this sentence.



    If the above examples (1)-(3) are well-formed and natural, how do you distinguish (1)-(3) from the CGEL example?










    share|improve this question


























      0












      0








      0


      1






      Here are some news article examples containing 'with my/their etc. being...' as supplement to a main clause:




      (1) Since the opposing counsel would be the U.S. Department of Justice, and with my being new to that game, I enlisted as co-counsel an accomplished federal litigator with extensive experience in dealing with the DOJ. (Source)



      (2) Since this raised many leftists' ire and with my being the reasonable man I am, I propose a compromise: no immigrants from the Third World or the Old World. In other words, no immigration, period. (Source)



      (3) The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and with their being hired by Divine Hope Church, both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name. (Source)




      Is the use of genitive pronouns (my, their, etc.) well-formed and natural?



      Or is it better to have accusative pronouns (me, them, etc.) instead?



      EDIT



      In a related question "with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phrase", I have shown this example from The Cambridge Grammar of the English Language (Page 461):




      We set off again, the Rover going precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with me staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether.




      CGEL says, and I agree, that my cannot replace me in this sentence.



      If the above examples (1)-(3) are well-formed and natural, how do you distinguish (1)-(3) from the CGEL example?










      share|improve this question
















      Here are some news article examples containing 'with my/their etc. being...' as supplement to a main clause:




      (1) Since the opposing counsel would be the U.S. Department of Justice, and with my being new to that game, I enlisted as co-counsel an accomplished federal litigator with extensive experience in dealing with the DOJ. (Source)



      (2) Since this raised many leftists' ire and with my being the reasonable man I am, I propose a compromise: no immigrants from the Third World or the Old World. In other words, no immigration, period. (Source)



      (3) The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and with their being hired by Divine Hope Church, both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name. (Source)




      Is the use of genitive pronouns (my, their, etc.) well-formed and natural?



      Or is it better to have accusative pronouns (me, them, etc.) instead?



      EDIT



      In a related question "with/without + pronoun (me vs. my) + gerund-participial phrase", I have shown this example from The Cambridge Grammar of the English Language (Page 461):




      We set off again, the Rover going precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with me staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether.




      CGEL says, and I agree, that my cannot replace me in this sentence.



      If the above examples (1)-(3) are well-formed and natural, how do you distinguish (1)-(3) from the CGEL example?







      gerunds grammatical-case gerund-phrases possessive-vs-oblique






      share|improve this question















      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question








      edited Mar 29 at 2:16







      JK2

















      asked Mar 27 at 6:54









      JK2JK2

      49811952




      49811952




















          1 Answer
          1






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          2














          1) and 2) are not acceptable to me, and I would guess that they are "errors" or "hypercorrections", although perhaps some speakers have internalized a grammar rule that permits me to be replaced with my in this context. (Compare the optional replacement of me with I or myself in certain contexts: me/I and me/myself variation might have been influenced by prescriptions or by imitations of prestigious constructions, but CaGEL says that the traditionally condemned uses of I and myself are grammatical, or at least not "hypercorrections", for some speakers.)



          3) seems acceptable to me. I think it could be rephrased as "The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and [with their hiring by Divine Hope Church], both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name" (replacing "being hired" with the gerundial noun "hiring").



          There do seem to be many more examples of the construction that I said feels unacceptable:




          • Well, with my being a pedagogue, as you know, my thoughts went back to my early years...
            (Bengt Tjellander)




          • With my being a member of the Sharpe family, it didn't set well for me to be marrying beneath the family. (Robert “Digger” Cartwright)



          I'm not sure about the acceptability of the following example:




          • Probably with my being a recent immigrant, the idiot thought he could get away with it by tossing off a ridiculous explanation... (Celly Luyinduladio)



          For comparison, the following two examples of "with my being a" feel quite acceptable to me (as would be expected, I think, since they aren't acting as a supplement to a main clause here):




          • My response to Knole and Sissinghurst seems in retrospect to have very much to do with my being a white Southern lesbian (Toni A. H. McNaron)




          • I mean that my mind has to extend through more stored memories associated with my being married as compared with the number of memories associated with my being a father. (Jon McGinnis)







          share|improve this answer

























          • So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:49











          • @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:52












          • @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:55












          • Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:57











          • @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:58











          Your Answer








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          1 Answer
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          1 Answer
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          active

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          1) and 2) are not acceptable to me, and I would guess that they are "errors" or "hypercorrections", although perhaps some speakers have internalized a grammar rule that permits me to be replaced with my in this context. (Compare the optional replacement of me with I or myself in certain contexts: me/I and me/myself variation might have been influenced by prescriptions or by imitations of prestigious constructions, but CaGEL says that the traditionally condemned uses of I and myself are grammatical, or at least not "hypercorrections", for some speakers.)



          3) seems acceptable to me. I think it could be rephrased as "The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and [with their hiring by Divine Hope Church], both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name" (replacing "being hired" with the gerundial noun "hiring").



          There do seem to be many more examples of the construction that I said feels unacceptable:




          • Well, with my being a pedagogue, as you know, my thoughts went back to my early years...
            (Bengt Tjellander)




          • With my being a member of the Sharpe family, it didn't set well for me to be marrying beneath the family. (Robert “Digger” Cartwright)



          I'm not sure about the acceptability of the following example:




          • Probably with my being a recent immigrant, the idiot thought he could get away with it by tossing off a ridiculous explanation... (Celly Luyinduladio)



          For comparison, the following two examples of "with my being a" feel quite acceptable to me (as would be expected, I think, since they aren't acting as a supplement to a main clause here):




          • My response to Knole and Sissinghurst seems in retrospect to have very much to do with my being a white Southern lesbian (Toni A. H. McNaron)




          • I mean that my mind has to extend through more stored memories associated with my being married as compared with the number of memories associated with my being a father. (Jon McGinnis)







          share|improve this answer

























          • So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:49











          • @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:52












          • @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:55












          • Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:57











          • @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:58















          2














          1) and 2) are not acceptable to me, and I would guess that they are "errors" or "hypercorrections", although perhaps some speakers have internalized a grammar rule that permits me to be replaced with my in this context. (Compare the optional replacement of me with I or myself in certain contexts: me/I and me/myself variation might have been influenced by prescriptions or by imitations of prestigious constructions, but CaGEL says that the traditionally condemned uses of I and myself are grammatical, or at least not "hypercorrections", for some speakers.)



          3) seems acceptable to me. I think it could be rephrased as "The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and [with their hiring by Divine Hope Church], both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name" (replacing "being hired" with the gerundial noun "hiring").



          There do seem to be many more examples of the construction that I said feels unacceptable:




          • Well, with my being a pedagogue, as you know, my thoughts went back to my early years...
            (Bengt Tjellander)




          • With my being a member of the Sharpe family, it didn't set well for me to be marrying beneath the family. (Robert “Digger” Cartwright)



          I'm not sure about the acceptability of the following example:




          • Probably with my being a recent immigrant, the idiot thought he could get away with it by tossing off a ridiculous explanation... (Celly Luyinduladio)



          For comparison, the following two examples of "with my being a" feel quite acceptable to me (as would be expected, I think, since they aren't acting as a supplement to a main clause here):




          • My response to Knole and Sissinghurst seems in retrospect to have very much to do with my being a white Southern lesbian (Toni A. H. McNaron)




          • I mean that my mind has to extend through more stored memories associated with my being married as compared with the number of memories associated with my being a father. (Jon McGinnis)







          share|improve this answer

























          • So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:49











          • @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:52












          • @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:55












          • Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:57











          • @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:58













          2












          2








          2







          1) and 2) are not acceptable to me, and I would guess that they are "errors" or "hypercorrections", although perhaps some speakers have internalized a grammar rule that permits me to be replaced with my in this context. (Compare the optional replacement of me with I or myself in certain contexts: me/I and me/myself variation might have been influenced by prescriptions or by imitations of prestigious constructions, but CaGEL says that the traditionally condemned uses of I and myself are grammatical, or at least not "hypercorrections", for some speakers.)



          3) seems acceptable to me. I think it could be rephrased as "The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and [with their hiring by Divine Hope Church], both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name" (replacing "being hired" with the gerundial noun "hiring").



          There do seem to be many more examples of the construction that I said feels unacceptable:




          • Well, with my being a pedagogue, as you know, my thoughts went back to my early years...
            (Bengt Tjellander)




          • With my being a member of the Sharpe family, it didn't set well for me to be marrying beneath the family. (Robert “Digger” Cartwright)



          I'm not sure about the acceptability of the following example:




          • Probably with my being a recent immigrant, the idiot thought he could get away with it by tossing off a ridiculous explanation... (Celly Luyinduladio)



          For comparison, the following two examples of "with my being a" feel quite acceptable to me (as would be expected, I think, since they aren't acting as a supplement to a main clause here):




          • My response to Knole and Sissinghurst seems in retrospect to have very much to do with my being a white Southern lesbian (Toni A. H. McNaron)




          • I mean that my mind has to extend through more stored memories associated with my being married as compared with the number of memories associated with my being a father. (Jon McGinnis)







          share|improve this answer















          1) and 2) are not acceptable to me, and I would guess that they are "errors" or "hypercorrections", although perhaps some speakers have internalized a grammar rule that permits me to be replaced with my in this context. (Compare the optional replacement of me with I or myself in certain contexts: me/I and me/myself variation might have been influenced by prescriptions or by imitations of prestigious constructions, but CaGEL says that the traditionally condemned uses of I and myself are grammatical, or at least not "hypercorrections", for some speakers.)



          3) seems acceptable to me. I think it could be rephrased as "The Jordans were serving at Destiny Life Church in Oakland, and [with their hiring by Divine Hope Church], both churches merged while keeping the Divine Hope name" (replacing "being hired" with the gerundial noun "hiring").



          There do seem to be many more examples of the construction that I said feels unacceptable:




          • Well, with my being a pedagogue, as you know, my thoughts went back to my early years...
            (Bengt Tjellander)




          • With my being a member of the Sharpe family, it didn't set well for me to be marrying beneath the family. (Robert “Digger” Cartwright)



          I'm not sure about the acceptability of the following example:




          • Probably with my being a recent immigrant, the idiot thought he could get away with it by tossing off a ridiculous explanation... (Celly Luyinduladio)



          For comparison, the following two examples of "with my being a" feel quite acceptable to me (as would be expected, I think, since they aren't acting as a supplement to a main clause here):




          • My response to Knole and Sissinghurst seems in retrospect to have very much to do with my being a white Southern lesbian (Toni A. H. McNaron)




          • I mean that my mind has to extend through more stored memories associated with my being married as compared with the number of memories associated with my being a father. (Jon McGinnis)








          share|improve this answer














          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited Mar 29 at 3:12

























          answered Mar 29 at 2:26









          sumelicsumelic

          51k8121230




          51k8121230












          • So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:49











          • @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:52












          • @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:55












          • Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:57











          • @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:58

















          • So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:49











          • @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:52












          • @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:55












          • Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

            – JK2
            Mar 29 at 2:57











          • @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

            – sumelic
            Mar 29 at 2:58
















          So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

          – JK2
          Mar 29 at 2:49





          So, you seem to be saying that 1-3 are marginally acceptable at best. Right? Also, what do you think about this revised example? The Rover went precariously slowly in very low gear up hills, with my staying on its tail in case it petered out altogether. Do you think my is acceptable here?

          – JK2
          Mar 29 at 2:49













          @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

          – sumelic
          Mar 29 at 2:52






          @JK2: No, I thought I clearly said that 1-2 feel distinctly less acceptable to me than 3: 3 seems more than "marginally acceptable" to me, and 1-2 only reach the level of "marginally acceptable" when I try to overthink things. My first reaction to 1-2 was just that they were unacceptable.

          – sumelic
          Mar 29 at 2:52














          @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

          – sumelic
          Mar 29 at 2:55






          @JK2: Oh, you revised the start of the sentence? I don't think that makes a difference to me in the acceptability of "with my staying" vs. "with me staying". "My" still seems unacceptable.

          – sumelic
          Mar 29 at 2:55














          Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

          – JK2
          Mar 29 at 2:57





          Yes, I have revised the sentence, because some people seem to think that the revision allows my in that sentence.

          – JK2
          Mar 29 at 2:57













          @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

          – sumelic
          Mar 29 at 2:58





          @JK2: I agree that the revision makes it less obvious.

          – sumelic
          Mar 29 at 2:58

















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